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Lizzy works in ceramics and small sculpture, which seem to reflect her fastidiousness, obsessive attention to detail, but also her delicacy and introversion, which is in contrast to the Top peanut jeff dunham buckle up buttercup you just flipped my bitch switch shirt in addition I really love this character of Jo’s larger personality and bold installation work. I’m wondering if your time spent working with the artist Cynthia Lahti—feeling the smallness and precision of ceramics, the tactile experience of painting, carving, sculpting—might have helped you to fill in Lizzy’s personality, the way she spoke, the way she walked, the way she interacted with the world. Williams: There was so much there for me. I went to [Cynthia’s] studio and spent time with her. Something very moving to me was that [everything was in her studio]. You can watch her work progress over the decades. She has been in this studio for years and years. You can look around the room, and it’s almost like an installation, a circular installation. You see her coming out of art school and then see this progression as she is thinking and working her way through to where she is now. And it made me think about how many hours she’s spent and how many failures she’s endured: how much failure is inherent in the art-making process. And she got back up and sat at the table. And she’s still sitting at the table. That really undoes me, it unravels me when I think about it. Because it’s incredibly lonely. And especially when you don’t know how far this work will go outside of you and your circle of friends. But she continues to show up at the table for herself, ultimately. It is a place where you can have control. Our friendships, our familial relationships, we can’t mastermind them. We can’t be above them. And there’s something about working with clay—it’s a place she’s found in which she is comfortable. When I saw Cynthia work and how swift she is with her motions now and how fast these girls—that’s what she calls them, “the girls”—how quickly they come to life all of the sudden, with a swift gesture of her hand, that this thing is breathing in front of you…it feels like a birth moment.There are many things about this film that are different from the rest of Kelly’s films. I think this difference is embodied in the character of Lizzy. In the other films, there is always a material exigency or economic anxiety, something that requires a need for extroversion or movement. Lizzy is the opposite. She is more homebound. Her anxieties are less about material need and more about artistic production.

Reichardt: But she has material needs. Like her hot water is broken. You can have material needs on different economic planes, where things are just broken. But did you find yourself approaching the Top peanut jeff dunham buckle up buttercup you just flipped my bitch switch shirt in addition I really love this character Lizzy differently because her life is so interiorized rather than motivated by circumstance or economic anxiety? Williams: I don’t know if I approached her any differently than any of the other women—or any other character. It’s kind of like a mystery. You’re solving a mystery. And you really hope that you have most of it figured out by day one. Because once you start filming, you’re committing things to the screen and you can’t go back and change your mind about them. They’ll always be a formation of this character. You want to have some understanding. Until then, you feel like you’re just trying to solve something. You’re scratching your head, and you’re just kind of perturbed. You’re just trying to find out who this person is. Then ultimately, the thing that is really fun is to make yourself available to things that still surprise you. The accidents that happen on set. I think you’re always hoping that something will get in your way. You want an obstacle, an impediment, a surprise, an accident, something that is going to throw you off and present new information about the person that you’ve become.

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